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DMT is just a glorified club racer , who puts out fancy videos for profit.
He added fork springs in one of my bikes, 'n "tuned" the suspension, 'n the thing was un-rideable. I had to pull over on the way home 'n fix his ****. I worked with the great Jim Lindemann back in the day, and that guy knew suspension.
Even with it's cheap @$$ OEM Dunlop tyres, a N400 has plenty of safe, mechanical grip straight off the showroom floor fer street ride'in.
We need more facepalm emojis 🤦‍♂️
Got ya covered :LOL:
 

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DMT is just a glorified club racer , who puts out fancy videos for profit.
He added fork springs in one of my bikes, 'n "tuned" the suspension, 'n the thing was un-rideable. I had to pull over on the way home 'n fix his ****. I worked with the great Jim Lindemann back in the day, and that guy knew suspension.
Even with it's cheap @$$ OEM Dunlop tyres, a N400 has plenty of safe, mechanical grip straight off the showroom floor fer street ride'in.

Got ya covered :LOL:
Where do you find this stuff....so fast????
 

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OK, as the moderator, I usually try to stay out of the soup unless the bowl starts to run over...but...

SDSS, a more proper response would be something like "thanks" or "cheers mate" or something like that, then if you are unhappy with the post you go and pull off your shock and measure it yourself. This should be done anyways since you are diving this deep into suspension and you will want to know the real free length of your spring. Or you could have asked Kiwi where he got the number from and go on from there.
But it is all cool. No bad feelings here. This forum is not like some of the other bike forums where bad attitude is the norm. We are one large dysfunctional family. We all disagree on many things except riding our Ninja/Z400's. This forum is made up of just about every type of rider, racers of many levels with decades of experience to the rider doing the first mile on their first bike. So we are glad you are here and keep us posted on your suspension arrangement.

PS: I think we are good on all the pasting of Dave Moss info into the threads... 😂
 

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The little video clips...dat stuff!
Welp, since I'm old people, I do this stuff on a 'puter. I just open another tab, type "whatever" gif, pick one of the many fine gifs, right click on it, 'n copy image location, then click on the little picture dealio at the bottom of reply window, and copy link location. Simple as cartwheel at the beach :ROFLMAO:
 

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Haha! I need to teach my husky to do a cartwheel on the beach!!

thanks for doing those gif things, it’s nice to have some form of humor while drinking my beer!
 

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Discussion Starter #31
Well my old man was chasing sheep back in the 70's on a CT125!!!

and I'm grinding the tip off my shoulder blade going round everyone as I lap them twice in one race. Beat that!

Ps. Are you an Australian?
The thing is man You weren’t racing me at the time.
Also I hope your talking about riding a Ninja 400 when you “lapped everyone 2wice”

to be hounest I’m gonna call you BS people who do that kind of riding would have a video cam without a doubt and a YouTube channel....Because that’s fairly “godly”

all I said is I passed a 636 twice and kept up with a 675.....

now kiwi 🥝 dude comes out like “IM GOD” I lapped everyone twice.

like I said I hope your talking about a ninja because I feel like buying the next plane ticket to the states to get this race rolling.
 

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Discussion Starter #32
DMT is just a glorified club racer , who puts out fancy videos for profit.
He added fork springs in one of my bikes, 'n "tuned" the suspension, 'n the thing was un-rideable. I had to pull over on the way home 'n fix his ****. I worked with the great Jim Lindemann back in the day, and that guy knew suspension.
Even with it's cheap @$$ OEM Dunlop tyres, a N400 has plenty of safe, mechanical grip straight off the showroom floor fer street ride'in.

Got ya covered :LOL:
DMT is a way better racer than you think man sounds like your trying to say your better.
plus he has trophy’s that you don’t.
I would also like to mention DMT does the head office paperwork at a Government level for Newzealand regarding suspension and it gets handed down to what small local business are required to do it’s written in books mate.

Yeah the thing is you can have a great oem tyre is just the plain simple fact with the tyre warning in your manual if you wish to change to any different that isn’t specified in the manual it requires a geometry correction.
All street bike swing arm angle are 8.5 to 9.5 degrees.

when you change the tyre circumference you could have a track swing arm angle due to the circumference difference and you are only at a street pace out at track....
You won’t have mechanical grip and the bike leaves you like it was nothing.
That’s why there should be a requirement of geometry correction when change to a new tyre.
A track swing arm angle is between 10-13 degrees.
There is no point running a track swing arm angle if cannot squash the stock one already given.

so I recommend correcting geometry for a new tyre to get mechanical grip, unless you stick with the oem specified tyre.

you can run an oem specified Hypersport tyre...
When you get to a fast pace and loose all mid corner stability...
You are then ready for a track swing arm angle of 10-13 degrees, correction of geometry will get you the mechanical grip.

thanks for reading.
 

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I think it's critical to mention that suspension preload should be adjusted to correct for weight changes, like the rider ingesting a big meal for example. Or worse, you ate a big pizza for dinner and it digests at a more leisurely rate, say a couple of days, meanwhile you're still eating heartily in between. Your bike's geometry is going to be affected by the extra weight you're carrying. It's very important to weigh yourself before every ride and adjust preload accordingly to correct the bike geometry. Murderously the front forks didn't come with preload adjusters, so, unless you've fitted aftermarket, best stay at home.
 

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Discussion Starter #34
I think it's critical to mention that suspension preload should be adjusted to correct for weight changes, like the rider ingesting a big meal for example. Or worse, you ate a big pizza for dinner and it digests at a more leisurely rate, say a couple of days, meanwhile you're still eating heartily in between. Your bike's geometry is going to be affected by the extra weight you're carrying. It's very important to weigh yourself before every ride and adjust preload accordingly to correct the bike geometry. Murderously the front forks didn't come with preload adjusters, so, unless you've fitted aftermarket, best stay at home.
That’s funny 😄 you could of just said starting point for any Supersports bike, riders sag is between 30-40mm have a minimum of 8mm rear static sag and 20mm front static.
use preload to adjust.
If you can’t make those numbers no matter how much you adjust your spring is either to stiff or too soft depending the number after rider measurement. Get the correct spring.

ADD A ZIP TIE🤦🏻‍♂️
when you bottom out front or rear to stop you Running wide or various other amounts of handling issues....ADD PRELOAD for the new pace you developed by adding 1 or 2 turns at a time...this should keep you safe and atleast 5-15 mm off bottom out. If under 5mm add preload....

When you bottom out and have no preload left....
You need to change to a stiffer spring starting the process off again with preload and ziptie.

you must also find fork bottom out.
what does it say for fork travel in the manual...fully extend the forks...minus book fork travel off bike extended fork travel gives you fork bottom out.
Mark it with a felt pen.

Thanks buddy for the laugh.
 

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Discussion Starter #35
OK, as the moderator, I usually try to stay out of the soup unless the bowl starts to run over...but...

SDSS, a more proper response would be something like "thanks" or "cheers mate" or something like that, then if you are unhappy with the post you go and pull off your shock and measure it yourself. This should be done anyways since you are diving this deep into suspension and you will want to know the real free length of your spring. Or you could have asked Kiwi where he got the number from and go on from there.
But it is all cool. No bad feelings here. This forum is not like some of the other bike forums where bad attitude is the norm. We are one large dysfunctional family. We all disagree on many things except riding our Ninja/Z400's. This forum is made up of just about every type of rider, racers of many levels with decades of experience to the rider doing the first mile on their first bike. So we are glad you are here and keep us posted on your suspension arrangement.

PS: I think we are good on all the pasting of Dave Moss info into the threads... 😂
You may have miss read or interpreted.
I was fairly thankful, I just needed rock head evidence for a mate and myself.

also The dude actually missed one critical step, it’s required to measure shock fully extended in the bike to know exactly how to get stock ride height on the aftermarket shock...
That’s why I asked for proof because I’m trying to find some other things.
Thank you though it’s all understandable really.
I’ll keep you guys updated when I can.
 

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I think it's critical to mention that suspension preload should be adjusted to correct for weight changes, like the rider ingesting a big meal for example. Or worse, you ate a big pizza for dinner and it digests at a more leisurely rate, say a couple of days, meanwhile you're still eating heartily in between. Your bike's geometry is going to be affected by the extra weight you're carrying. It's very important to weigh yourself before every ride and adjust preload accordingly to correct the bike geometry. Murderously the front forks didn't come with preload adjusters, so, unless you've fitted aftermarket, best stay at home.
^^ This is solid 'rock hard' info. I've got a set of bathroom scales that I keep in my van just for track days. You'd be amazed at how much difference track day lunch options can have on your suspension set up requirements. For example A Big Mac meal will have me reaching for the clickers every time, but if I stick to just say a caesar salad or such like (good brain food too - win/win) then I'm good to go with my base settings.
Funny, I've never seen Dave Moss discuss this in any of his clips. :unsure:
 

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Discussion Starter #37 (Edited)
^^ This is solid 'rock hard' info. I've got a set of bathroom scales that I keep in my van just for track days. You'd be amazed at how much difference track day lunch options can have on your suspension set up requirements. For example A Big Mac meal will have me reaching for the clickers every time, but if I stick to just say a caesar salad or such like (good brain food too - win/win) then I'm good to go with my base settings.
Funny, I've never seen Dave Moss discuss this in any of his clips. :unsure:
I think you are cleary going way over the top but anywhoo. Don’t try and burn DMT you will get nowhere man, I’m a paid subscriber and he has a ton of information about geometry/tyres warnings ect.
All I ask was some simple “clarity” “proof”
So a simple explanation like “bro” or “dude” “fella” Just measure from the centre of the top bolt to the centre of the lower bolt would of been nice.

but for my “issue“ and will be for a lot of people I had to clarify with the Moss man himself.
So for me having a stock oem tyre I wish to have same geometry ride height when I change to an aftermarket shock I needed to know how to exactly measure....
It was slightly more than you may said as I did give topic as to why I needed to do this.
Also as the warning ⚠ clearly states in the manual when I change to a new tyre it will have a circumference difference database, check what mine is OEM then obviously 🙄 + or - the difference To correct geometry using the new Shock with ride height Adjuster then obtaining mechanical grip.
Also axle position will change.

when I finally go through the stock swing arm angle out at track getting mid corner instability which will only be when I get at pace with a better suspension setup I can then use a track swing arm angle.

I’m just here to help man I don’t use your terminology as such but I dare say it’s hilarious.
here is some picture evidence.
12998
12999
13000
 

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Don't forget gearing sizing for the new swing arm angle! If you don't change your sprockets the chain will first eat your swing arm rubber guard then start in on your swing arm and all the while they are throwing off the anti squat you worked so hard to get by changing ride height. Have fun with this one!!!!
 

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Discussion Starter #39 (Edited)
Don't forget gearing sizing for the new swing arm angle! If you don't change your sprockets the chain will first eat your swing arm rubber guard then start in on your swing arm and all the while they are throwing off the anti squat you worked so hard to get by changing ride height. Have fun with this one!!!!
Sorry man but there is a way around it without even changing gearing size for the new swing arm angle, you can leave it stock gearing and simply Change the chain linkages to suit.

Gearing is for specific tracks, so you can use All the power in the straight and get to a desired top speed without having a gear left over, eg your at the top of 5th at the end of the straight and have another whole 6th gear left.
that’s when a combination change will happen.
 

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Best of luck, we are on entirely different pages for geometry, gearing and how the diameter of the counter shaft sprocket and rear sprocket affect anti squat which is the reason a rider would be changing the angle of the swing arm to begin with. I'm not sure I follow "chain linkages" but that is ok, it sounds like you've got it under control. These are great little bikes and I'm sure you're having a blast beating up on bigger bikes like the rest of us.

Keep the rubber side down!!!!
 
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