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Discussion Starter #1
Hello all. Been lurking a bit and decided to make an account. Here’s a short intro.

I’m 37 years old. Started riding in 2013, so I am late to the party. I took all of 2016 off due to deployments, a training period and settling in my new duty station. I am in thr military.

I started with an EX500 in San Diego.After 3600ish miles I thought I was ready for a new bike. Bought a 2012 N650 and promptly wrecked it within 360ish miles. I didn’t think that bike was too much for me. I think that accident was me riding well over my skill level in the Playground on the 94 in San Diego. I really liked that bike and bought a 2013. My second 650 rolled around 13,000 miles, countless mods including suspension and a whole ZX6R front end swap. While owning that bike I joined a Socal forum called socalsportbikes.org and through that met some local riders in San Diego. I joined a group on the San Diego sportbike meet up group and did lots of canyon riding with them. I sold that bike and ended up with an 09 ZX6R. Loved that bike but was just going too fast on the street just commuting but not really learning to ride fast in the canyons (relative to those canyon junkies). I grew interest in the R3, sold my 600 and almost regretted it at first. It wasn’t the lack of power, I got over that quickly. It was the lack of braking power since I was so used to the awesome stopping power of the 4-pot dual Nissans. After a while though I got used to it and really enjoyed the smaller lighter bikes. I did my first track day in October 2015 and was hooked on small, light weight bikes. Did my second track day before I left San Diego and got stationed in Japan.

I commute daily on my bike. I no longer do recreational riding on the street. As long as we aren’t deployed, I’ll aim for 2-4 track days per month, even during winter. I know some of you folks from the R3 forum.

Admittedly, I don’t own a ninja 400. I’m here for info. I’m at the point where I am chasing a certain track Lap time. There is still progress to be made but at this point I am comparing my relatively new skill level (4 Years with 16 trackdays and god knows how many canyons rides where I was probably learning incorrect techniques) against racers. I am currently 3 seconds away from a buddies lap time on a Duke 690 while I am on an R25. I believe moving to a ninja 400 will shrink, if not close that gap. I know it’s cheating but I’m also itching for a new bike lol.

This community looks like it has a lot to offer. Sorry for the loooong post.
 

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Discussion Starter #5 (Edited)
Thanks all! @ Xorbe: I haven’t sifted through all of the posts yet, but do you own the 400 yet? I’m chasing lap times, specifically 5 seconds or better. I know it’s cheating but I believe a 400 will close that gap.

Kiwi, you were on R3 forums too yeah? Deddie as well I believe? Quite a few familiar names.

SDM, your post on the bike being on the operating table has been a great source of info, thanks for that!

Currently trying to sell myself onto the 400. I still don’t like how Kawi cheaper out on th swing arm. The R25, CBR250RR, and 390 all have good looking swing arms. All budget bikes too (well, except the 250rr, which is crazy expensive for a 250). I wish the kawi alsonwould have had a better fork. It’s 2018. It’s is putting out a small bike with slipper, usd forks, and good looking swing arm and overall good looking bike. I’m sure all the other manufacturers can too within the price range. Anyways, I have an entire deployment to think about the bike so yeah. I think to get it to the level of where my R25 is, the bike will end up costing around $10,000.
 

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@ Xorbe: I haven’t sifted through all of the posts yet, but do you own the 400 yet?
I'm the odd ball out around here with a '17 Ninja 650 and 765 RS. I don't say much, just lurking. I was hitting the freeway more than expected, so I took a shot with the bike with more torque, and it's working out so far. For the track I'd think that the 400 would be the fun machine with 25% higher red line. What are you waiting for? :devil:
 

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Discussion Starter #7
I'm the odd ball out around here with a '17 Ninja 650 and 765 RS. I don't say much, just lurking. I was hitting the freeway more than expected, so I took a shot with the bike with more torque, and it's working out so far. For the track I'd think that the 400 would be the fun machine with 25% higher red line. What are you waiting for? :devil:
I am waiting for this deployment ( that hasn’t started yet) to be over. Lol.

Side note, as I mentioned I’m going to need to be at around $10,000 before the bike gets to where I want it. Shock, forks, full of exhaust, ecu tune, case covers, clip ons, Brembo master cylinder and caliper, etc. Prettt much what my R25 was looking like, with the bigger engine though. I can literally buy a Tuono with extras parts for less than that. I really do enjoy the smaller bikes though. Except changing 110 front tires. I hate changing 110’s on my NoMar tire changer. That, and I’ll be going way too fast for my own good again(why I sold the 600). But yeah, probably after the deployment I’ll be on a new bike.
 

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Kiwi, you were on R3 forums too yeah?

The R25, CBR250RR, and 390 all have good looking swing arms. All budget bikes too (well, except the 250rr, which is crazy expensive for a 250). I wish the kawi alsonwould have had a better fork. It’s 2018. It’s is putting out a small bike with slipper, usd forks, and good looking swing arm and overall good looking bike.
Yeah I was on there mainly last year when I was trying to work out my next move from the CBR. When Kawi announced they were doing a 400 that sealed it for me. Wasn't a hard decision as wasn't looking at 650's.

You are lucky living in Japan and having access to some different models. I love those CBR250RR's . I'd go for one of those!

Agree with your thoughts on cheap looking swing arms and lack of USD forks. The conventional forks on the N400 do work well though, but the rear shock is a bit average.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
Yeah I was on there mainly last year when I was trying to work out my next move from the CBR. When Kawi announced they were doing a 400 that sealed it for me. Wasn't a hard decision as wasn't looking at 650's.

You are lucky living in Japan and having access to some different models. I love those CBR250RR's . I'd go for one of those!

Agree with your thoughts on cheap looking swing arms and lack of USD forks. The conventional forks on the N400 do work well though, but the rear shock is a bit average.
I’m somewhat ok with the forks. I want something that works over something that looks good but doesn’t. In thr case of 400 vs 390, both work mediocre without internals. But both bikes are in the same price range, so I just feel kawi could have followed that lead.

Thr cbr250rr is an amazing little bike, with a claimed 38 hp out of a 250 engine. But it’s expensive for a 250. The Kawi imo is a great value for street riders, and for track riders like me looking for better lap times. Since I do both, it’s an awesome value. Being a bit realistic, I don’t think I will get lap times like those 250 racers. Them boys will smoke the every day track junkie regardless of what bike they are on. Here’s an example :

 

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I’m somewhat ok with the forks. I want something that works over something that looks good but doesn’t. In thr case of 400 vs 390, both work mediocre without internals. But both bikes are in the same price range, so I just feel kawi could have followed that lead.

Thr cbr250rr is an amazing little bike, with a claimed 38 hp out of a 250 engine. But it’s expensive for a 250. The Kawi imo is a great value for street riders, and for track riders like me looking for better lap times. Since I do both, it’s an awesome value. Being a bit realistic, I don’t think I will get lap times like those 250 racers. Them boys will smoke the every day track junkie regardless of what bike they are on. Here’s an example :

https://youtu.be/L4J69hNpYvk
haha typical Honda always throwing numbers around same as Yamaha, aka the r3 is 42hp....which it isnt, you're lucky to get 35hp on the rear wheel, Some dynos have even stated 32hp. the Ninja 400 "Canadian,Indian and malay" comes with 50hp to the rear wheel with some real nice torque figures. theirs a reason why most racing events have had to restrict the ninja 400 multiple times, its because its just destroying the competition, in fact If i remember correctly even after all the restrictions the 400 that Ana Carrasco rode ended up destroying the lap record on not 1 but 2 races already by over 10 seconds...and this is with restrictions. Im just not very much a yamaha or honda fan because of the way they do things, I like the green way of doing things different aka with the h2, it makes no sense and thats why i love it, its just saying "look what we can do" I take it back though lol I do love Honda's its just something about yamaha's that I have never liked, even the clutch always feels off on yamahas in my opinion .
 

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...
Thr cbr250rr is an amazing little bike, with a claimed 38 hp out of a 250 engine. But it’s expensive for a 250. The Kawi imo is a great value for street riders...
The 250RR seems to be a jewel at least on the papers.
I guess it doesn't have a market on US because of its cost.


How much more expensive is the 250RR against the N400 in the Japanese market? What are both prices in Japan?

Japan seems to be a great place to be a rider. Enjoy!


Welcome to the forum!
 

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Discussion Starter #12 (Edited)
http://i67.tinypic.com/1z5rp07.jpg
haha typical Honda always throwing numbers around same as Yamaha, aka the r3 is 42hp....which it isnt, you're lucky to get 35hp on the rear wheel, Some dynos have even stated 32hp. the Ninja 400 "Canadian,Indian and malay" comes with 50hp to the rear wheel with some real nice torque figures. theirs a reason why most racing events have had to restrict the ninja 400 multiple times, its because its just destroying the competition, in fact If i remember correctly even after all the restrictions the 400 that Ana Carrasco rode ended up destroying the lap record on not 1 but 2 races already by over 10 seconds...and this is with restrictions. Im just not very much a yamaha or honda fan because of the way they do things, I like the green way of doing things different aka with the h2, it makes no sense and thats why i love it, its just saying "look what we can do" I take it back though lol I do love Honda's its just something about yamaha's that I have never liked, even the clutch always feels off on yamahas in my opinion .
I just dyno’d my R25. Made 33.4, so I would say the R3 wouldnt have a very hard time making 35-36. There are plenty of dyno charts floating around if you look. You have any links showing those N400’s putting out 50 hp at the wheel stock? I’ve owned 4 Kawis. I don’t become brand loyal. Whatever is a fun ride is what I’ll hop on.

Edit: tinypic links don’t work here?

Edit 2: that’s 33.4 with only an Akra slip on.

 

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Discussion Starter #13
The 250RR seems to be a jewel at least on the papers.
I guess it doesn't have a market on US because of its cost.


How much more expensive is the 250RR against the N400 in the Japanese market? What are both prices in Japan?

Japan seems to be a great place to be a rider. Enjoy!


Welcome to the forum!
Japan has amazing roads. Tracks are everywhere and are also family oriented, with restaurants, bathrooms, amusement parks as well. I saw a batch of 400’s for 650,000 Yen, so $5,900 OTD? 250rr was 799,000 Yen.
 
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http://i67.tinypic.com/1z5rp07.jpg

I just dyno’d my R25. Made 33.4, so I would say the R3 wouldnt have a very hard time making 35-36. There are plenty of dyno charts floating around if you look. You have any links showing those N400’s putting out 50 hp at the wheel stock? I’ve owned 4 Kawis. I don’t become brand loyal. Whatever is a fun ride is what I’ll hop on.

Edit: tinypic links don’t work here?

Edit 2: that’s 33.4 with only an Akra slip on.

you misunderstood mate, I said people are thinking that the r3 is making 42hp and comparing that to the ninja 400's 45hp though what people are not realising is kawasaki didnt say its 45hp to the crank but to the wheel for "euro models" and 50hp for "can,may,ind" models while the r3 is not 42hp to the wheel though to the crank. Look at most dyno charts it all around the 35hp mark for the r3 and as I said some come even lower and some slightly higher, Also I have posted multiple times of the 400 getting 50hp stock, some members have even hit 53hp "full system tuned" with the restricted euro model while some with the Malaysian model "full system tuned" have dyno'ed it at 58hp.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
you misunderstood mate, I said people are thinking that the r3 is making 42hp and comparing that to the ninja 400's 45hp though what people are not realising is kawasaki didnt say its 45hp to the crank but to the wheel for "euro models" and 50hp for "can,may,ind" models while the r3 is not 42hp to the wheel though to the crank. Look at most dyno charts it all around the 35hp mark for the r3 and as I said some come even lower and some slightly higher, Also I have posted multiple times of the 400 getting 50hp stock, some members have even hit 53hp "full system tuned" with the restricted euro model while some with the Malaysian model "full system tuned" have dyno'ed it at 58hp.
I know most figures from manufacturers will be high. I haven’t been on this forum as long as you so I couldn’t have seen every post you made, which is why I asked if you have links to those stock bike dyno sheets with 50hp on them.
 

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Japan has amazing roads. Tracks are everywhere and are also family oriented, with restaurants, bathrooms, amusement parks as well. I saw a batch of 400’s for 650,000 Yen, so $5,900 OTD? 250rr was 799,000 Yen.
Japan is rapidly coming to top of my must visit list. I will coincide it with a Moto GP or something and a factory tour or two.

Regarding the Ninja HP figures, most of the Dyno print outs I have seen from US based members have been between 41 & 43 RWHP. But at this stage I am unsure of the state of tune of the US models as there are no claimed power figures on the Kawasaki.com website, unlike other countries.
 

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Discussion Starter #17
Japan is rapidly coming to top of my must visit list. I will coincide it with a Moto GP or something and a factory tour or two.

Regarding the Ninja HP figures, most of the Dyno print outs I have seen from US based members have been between 41 & 43 RWHP. But at this stage I am unsure of the state of tune of the US models as there are no claimed power figures on the Kawasaki.com website, unlike other countries.
I still haven't been able to sift through everything yet as mentioned, but from what I gather, the different countries making different power is just through the ECU? Is that just because they are limiting the revs in different country models?


Moto GP is awesome. My first time was last year, and I went alone. I should have brought the whole family, because little did I know its catered to familes as well, with hotels if you want, theme parks, restaurants, etc.


I will not be around for 2018 Moto GP but next year for sure. If you ever go, let me know!
 

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I still haven't been able to sift through everything yet as mentioned, but from what I gather, the different countries making different power is just through the ECU? Is that just because they are limiting the revs in different country models?


Moto GP is awesome. My first time was last year, and I went alone. I should have brought the whole family, because little did I know its catered to familes as well, with hotels if you want, theme parks, restaurants, etc.


I will not be around for 2018 Moto GP but next year for sure. If you ever go, let me know!
I wont be there either this year, I've committed my leave and funds to another trip already.
I've only been to Australian Moto GP and really enjoyed it too.

The different spec models all have the same redline, best guess at this stage is that the tweaking is done through the ECU fuel and ignition timing maps. More discussion here if your interested:
https://www.ninja400riders.com/foru...scussion/931-higher-output-north-america.html
 

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I wont be there either this year, I've committed my leave and funds to another trip already.
I've only been to Australian Moto GP and really enjoyed it too.

The different spec models all have the same redline, best guess at this stage is that the tweaking is done through the ECU fuel and ignition timing maps. More discussion here if your interested:
https://www.ninja400riders.com/foru...scussion/931-higher-output-north-america.html
I still think its not only ignition but also flaps closing to around 70-80% after hitting 10k rpm due to the line looking so flat but meh idk, I have always wanted to go to Japan, its been a life long dream. maybe next year if all goes well.
 

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@Kojiiro

welcome to the forums. I started to reply to you a few days ago then real life took over and I never got to finish. I am just a beginner racers, this is my first year and so far I like it. I am like you and done a lot of track days, then one day a friend and I decided we would race this year. The N400 is more then capable of racing with a few upgrades. For my size and weight suspension is/was a must. The power is good, however I get out run by guys on R3's the guys riding them are doing times close to the guys on 1000cc bikes. They hardly ever touch the brakes my best time on my last race was 1:58, these guys are turning in 1:45 or less. the 1000cc are turning in 1:42. So I am not sure if its more horsepower or lots and lots of practice, trust in the tires and just letting it all hang out. Again welcome.
 
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